The Peaceful Home

Episode 20: A Journey of Grief and Love with Annette Hines

April 08, 2022 Pamela Godbois
The Peaceful Home
Episode 20: A Journey of Grief and Love with Annette Hines
Show Notes Transcript

Webinar Link: Becoming the Heart Centered CEO

“Ultimately, if the audience can take one thing away from this conversation, I would love for them to just get that. If they have one good idea and passion that they want to follow, they should absolutely go for it because it's possible. It's more than possible. It's like really,  honestly the best thing that you could do.”


Welcome to Episode #20 of The Out of Your Mind Podcast. Thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to show up for yourself and tune in. 


In this week’s episode, I sat down to chat with Special Needs Attorney, and advocate Annette Hines. As a special needs parent herself, Annette has dedicated her life after the loss of her daughter to helping other families navigate the legal and social world with more ease and clarity. The owner of multiple businesses all focused on helping those with special needs and their families, Annette has such an amazing and beautiful story to share. 


Annette Hines has been practicing in the areas of Special Needs, Elder Law and Estate Planning for over twenty years.  Ms. Hines brings personal experience with special needs to her practice, as the mother of two daughters, one of whom passed away from Mitochondrial Disease in November 2013. This deep personal understanding of special needs fuels her passion for quality special needs planning and drives her dedication to the practice.


What inspired you this episode? I’d love to hear from you. Take a screenshot, tag @yoginipam &  @parentingimpossbile  on Instagram, and share something that resonated with you from this week’s episode with Annette Hines.


Here’s a quick glance at this episode…


[00:07:55] The key to being an entrepreneur according to Annette. 


[00:10:50] How struggles and love, inspired a major shift in her world, and how that grew into the businesses she runs today. 


[00:16:10] The pain and love that became a book, and the healing that offered. 


[00:35:05] The importance of having guidance and support in your life as a human and a business owner. 


[00:43:05] Learning to embrace the possibilities and follow your passion is a must. 


Rate, Review, & Follow on Apple podcasts at https://pamgodbois.com/ApplePodcast Leaving a review helps me to continue to create more content for entrepreneurs, just like you, looking to level up their life and business by stepping into alignment. Click here, scroll to the bottom, and tap “Write a Review” to get started.


Links: 

Guest Website: http://specialneedscompanies.com/


Let’s connect on Instagram, Facebook & Tiktok


Thank you so much for listening to this week’s episode. Be sure to tune in next week.

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The best thing you can do for yourself and your kids is effectively regulate your nervous system. And a great place to start >> to wire the brain for gratitude. Research tells us that gratitude increases happiness and a peaceful mindset. Make the shift and watch how things in your life start to change. Sign up today! www.pamgodbois.com/gratitude

Pam:

Welcome back to the out of your mind podcast. Today on episode number 20, I have the chance to sit down with a net Heinz. And that is a special needs attorney and entrepreneur. The founder of the special needs companies, which is both a social service agency and a law practice. And that is passionate about helping families access the services and the supports that they need for their special needs family members. Join me today. Well, Annette shares her story. And all of her nuggets of wisdom that she's learned throughout her lifetime. So let's dive in Annette, thank you so much for being here with me today and coming on the podcast and being willing to share your journey, your story of healing that you've gone through in your in your lifetime, essentially. I would love for you to share. What has brought you here to this place? Not on the podcast, but this place in your life, up until this point.

Annette:

Well, first of all, Pam, thank you so much for having me as cause we were talking before you press the record button, I'm really excited to be here. I think that your podcast is amazing. I love the whole premise of it. So thank you so much for letting me be on this journey with you. I think it's awesome. And. My story kind of starts where I became a mom in my twenties before I really knew much, I finished school as an attorney, a young attorney and got pregnant right away. After I got married with my, I have to say that for my mom, get it to anybody else. But I say that for my mother, but and my daughter was, my first daughter was born as a 29 week, two pound preemie. So anybody who's ever had kids or knows anything about kids knows just right away that's the trauma, right? So that was a trauma birth. And. I didn't know anything about being a mother or really being an advocate. But I love to say that on the day that my daughter Elizabeth was born, an advocate was born to, and my life changed at that moment. Not just because I was a mom, but because the whole course of my life took a different turn. I mean, I always was going to be an attorney, but I didn't know that I was going to be. This passionate advocate for people with disabilities. I went to school to become a civil rights attorney and I wanted to do great things for women and children, but this, just threw a little monkey wrench in. And I had another child after Elizabeth, Caroline who you know I could do a whole nother podcast on what it's like. For siblings of disabled children, because they go through so much trauma as well. Raising Elizabeth w who we found out a few years later actually had mitochondrial disease, which is a rare neuromuscular disorder. That's in the muscular dystrophy family. It unfortunately took her life. It took her from us when she was 17. It's a degenerative disease. So it's all these little losses, throughout your life, throughout her life. And she was a wheelchair user. She didn't speak she was blind. So the worst of it though, was. Just that she had so many health issues and there were so many scares and there were multiple times when we thought that she wasn't going to be with us very much longer. In fact, they told us when she was little that she probably wasn't going to live past like three. And then they said, yeah, probably not pass five or six. And then she just kept thriving, so we stopped living, like waiting for death and. We lived as a family. And I could spend the next hour just talking about what that was like, and I'm sure that many of your listeners will know what I'm talking about because one in five families in the United States is impacted by disability these days, one in five. And that means that so many people have some. Kind of idea whether it's for either themselves or a family member or close friend, they will understand somewhat what I'm talking about and what it's like to live with some impediment some form of disability and. So, as I am raising my family and my marriage blows up, so many peoples in this position, I am, starting my career as an attorney, but nobody wants me. Nobody will hire me. I'm this young woman with these kids and I can't work 90 hour work weeks, unfortunately back when I graduated from law school, that's the jobs that were out there. And that's the commitment level that was expected of you? It hasn't changed too much, unfortunately. I mean, it has a little bit, but so the only thing for me to do was to start out on my own as an entrepreneur and hang my own shingle, which is what I did because. What was I going to do nothing, I needed to work and I needed to make money. And I also, I wanted to do something. So I started out as a disability attorney and you know what, Pam. Women's showed up for me because guess what? That's what women do. Right. And I had a couple of great mentors who are also special needs moms who showed up in my life and they mentored me along. And when I needed help, when my life was falling apart, they were there for me. When I needed a little work, they'd throw some to me when I just needed. An answer to a question they were there and that's how I grew. And my business grew amazingly because our community, our disability community is built on authenticity. And that is the key to being an entrepreneur. It's just being that authentic self, but then my daughter, as the years came along she really did start to decline as she got into her teenage years in life, really got rough for us. And around the time that she really was in trouble, I started. Special needs law group, which was really the passion of my life I had at a point joined another firm I had gotten Lord away to affirm because once your business grows, everybody's looking over and saying, there's revenue there. Right? You might want to come and join me now that you've done all the hard work to raise your business.

Pam:

Right? You're like, where were you? I needed you.

Annette:

Right. But now it looks so wonderful. And and they also, when those gentlemen are looking over at you, they're like, well, you've got that great little marketing hook as that special needs, mom, that everybody wants to come and work with. So I think I can market that. I think I can sell that to people. So, so you know they want that. They want to say, Hey, there's a net come and do business with her. She's a special needs, mom. She knows exactly what you're going through. But they don't want to hear that you have to go to therapy appointments with your kid and you can only work until two o'clock and you're not going to be there for the partner dinner at 7:00 PM because you're putting your kids to bed. So they, they just want to have it both ways. And if it doesn't work, it's not consistent. It's and again, I think actually the last couple of years of COVID has taught us that we. Live differently, but that's, I don't want, I don't want to go down that side. However, I will say that when I started to really have difficulty at work I really was not able to hold it together in a firm environment. So I left and for once, and for all, really started out on my own with a bigger firm environment with employees and so forth. It wasn't the best time in the world. Or as my daughter would say the bestest time mom to really start a business, but I had to because I just could not make it in from life. And my daughter, Elizabeth inspired me to do. I wanted to create something that my family could not find when we were looking for services for ourselves, there was nothing like it out there. And I think that, you know exactly what I'm talking about with your practice and what you tried to do and what you were doing with your practice. So, it's just so important to me that we create this space. For people who for families like mine and who just could not find what they needed. And that is exactly where I ended up. So just to cut to the end of the story I lost Elizabeth and I always, get a little choked up whenever I have to talk about that, but it was a. It's just the worst thing in the world to go through. Nobody should ever have to live through something like that. She died at home. We were able to support her and surround her with love, but we lost her. And for two years I was like a zombie and it was really tough. I kept things going. I was really a treading water, but then I joined a group at children's hospital, the team there, the hospice team there, they never gave up on me and they finally got me to come to a group and it was important because I didn't want to go to any old kind of grief group because they just didn't understand what I had gone through. But this group was full of parents, just like me. Who had children who are sick, not just children who had been lost to anything, a car accident or suicide. Not that those things are not awful and traumatic, but for me, what I needed was people to understand what it was like to do this for 17 years to be a nurse, to do like central lines. Work and G-tubes, and just it's like I had been in a war, and I needed recovery and it was the start of an incredibly healing experience for me. And I started a journal during that time and that became a book halfway through writing it. I. I looked at it and I was like, oh my God, this could actually be something. I never knew that I was actually writing a book when I started at PM. And I realized that it was important to share our stories and that it could be really helpful. And it was, and that became. The turning point for me. And I really w I was able to come out of that and I'm me, but I'm different me. And took me a while to figure out who I was without Elizabeth asking the important questions. Am I still a special needs parent without a special needs kid? Am I still a special needs attorney without a special needs kid? Am I still welcome in this community, like all of those important questions and, oh my God, that answer was a resounding yes. To all of that, but it was important. And you like to say, I had to do the work. The work is important. And it made such a difference with my clients too. And also it brought me to the next company that I wanted to create. To help families and the things that I'm doing now. And I'm so proud of the work that we're all doing together and the community that it's creating. And I'm really glad that I'm able to carry on Elisabeth's legacy. So there's my story and it's one of joy for sure.

Pam:

Yeah, it sounds like it, you talked about this conflict after Elizabeth passing

Annette:

where

Pam:

you, you almost have an identity crisis where you were like, who, who exactly am I now? Because I've just spent the last 17 years, especially as like a first-time mom. Right. And then. All the shit that goes along with being a first-time mom anyway, and then bringing another daughter into the world and all of the things. And then you're still you're still a mom. But going through this this identity crisis when your daughter passed that

Annette:

now

Pam:

became the inspiration for your healing

Annette:

journey, right? It was. Unique to say the least, and I can't find people to talk to about it because, it's rare to find who am I going to find? Who's another attorney like me, who's lost a child. Like it's a crisis. Of epic proportion for me only. Right? Right.

Pam:

Well, and that's the benefit and the beauty of sharing your story because who knows you, man, we may have a listener that says actually I tick that box. Yep. I tick that box. Let's like let's connect. Amazing. What for you, what were the things that you did to help you during those darkest times? Those most challenging times?

Annette:

Well, definitely writing the book was amazing. So freaking painful, so painful. And it's not a happy book, but it there's joy in there for sure. And it comes out of. The other side. So it's a good book really well received, which I was so grateful for because you never know when you give birth to something like that, what's going to happen with it. So thank God for that. But that was great. And, I really found salvation in my work and of course, Being with Caroline. My other daughter was amazing and I was really lucky that I had another relationship husband, number two. And he's my rock. He likes to say, he ha he's like best supporting actor. He's like the man behind the woman. And I love him for that. He was the foundation that kept this family going, because like I said, I was numb for two years and he just he's in the practice with me. And he just patiently paddled along in the boat until I could take a breath. I really literally felt like I was not breathing for two years. And slowly I came back to life and a needed to just B with what was happening. I think I explained to you, the metaphor that I used in my book was that I was being battered by waves and they were coming at me from all directions. And I was in a long storm, but eventually it subsided. And when I was done, I was changed. The shoreline was very different, but I recognize that I was still me. It just was a different me, but still under the core, it was still me. I'm still there. And that's how I realized. I could still be all of those things, but actually better, so, how did I get all that work done? Well, the generosity of other people just never ceases to amaze me working with families in my position. And giving time to them really healed me as well. Once I get out of my own head and sat to do work with other people, it was amazing how healing and helpful that was as well.

Pam:

Yeah. Yeah. And that really speaks to connection because the work that you're doing. Yes, you're an attorney and that may or may not, depending on the attorney create a sense of connection, but the work that you're specifically doing, working with special needs families. As a special needs attorney as a mother of a special needs child, that's a different, that's a whole nother animal, right? And so you have this ability, you this this opportunity really to connect with the families that you're working with and connection breeds so much healing, regardless of who's helping who connection breeds healing. That's we are connected communal

Annette:

beings. So true. And so much of what we do is long-term and not just transactional in the work that we do. And we get, we're very connected to a lot of community organizations. We are very involved in our community and the disability communities, very close knit. So it is a very a very healing. Opportunity. It's a very good healing opportunity to stand beside your neighbors and to make dinner for people or to do a clothing drive or to go to a ballgame together. Or donate your services for somebody that needs it, but can't afford to pay whatever the case may be just showing up for people. It just feels so good to get out of your own way for a little while. And yeah, it's been eight years for me since Elizabeth passed and it was about year five, that things really turned around, Yeah.

Pam:

And how long has the the special needs family services company, your company, number two, business number two. Right. How long has that been? Doing its thing. When did that get created?

Annette:

So I decided to start that company in January of 2020. So that was real really smart timing. But we it was fine. Really. It got launched. And then we just ended up having a slow launch because of COVID. We already had a lot of the business that we were doing within the law firm and we just moved it out of the law firm and into its own company this year in 2021 that just passed this year, that just passed. We were able to really get rocking and rolling with it. And in 2022. We are offering under family services. We've been acting as a trustee, guardian conservator and standing in the shoes of a family member or caregiver care manager to do things for people that maybe if they don't have a trusted person in their life, to be able to do that for them. Something that people had been telling me over and over again, for years, that was one of their deepest concerns. And it was also something that scared the crap out of me when I was raising my daughter who's going to do this when I'm not here. It's not just 24 7, but I do the work of five people to take care of her. Who's going to do this. So the next. Phase of what we're creating though, is really ultimately what I am so excited about because it just goes so beyond the law, most families really need education. And I know that you're a strong proponent of. Education information. It's so key. And so we are launching a group coaching program for people. It is, it's so exciting and we're moving it out of the law firm because the L the legal piece is intimidating to people. And also it's very expensive. And because of. How things are under the law group. We have to charge certain fees to be able to offer those services to people, but under family services, it's not legal services. So we can offer people information at a much lower price point in a group environment. And we can do it as a COVID. People helping people. Right. And I'm so excited about that because there's just nothing like it out there. There's there are, so I get a dozen calls a day from people who want to just sit with me and have. Walk them through a plan for their family member, a person centered plan, a transition plan, something plan because they need information. So I've been wracking my brain trying to figure out. How to get this information to people in a way that doesn't require me individually to meet with every single person, because I can't do it so hours in the day. And, COVID just with all of the zooming and everything. It just helped me figure out because as the coaching business has grown a lot and a lot of industries that you never would have thought would be able to do this. Are now doing it, medical, psychology, everything. And I thought this is a great way to be able to reach more people at a price that they can afford and to be able to get them launched. I'm so excited. I am all about trying to get all this information out, which is why Three years ago, I started the podcast and we have a private Facebook group, but it's free just to keep trying to get information out to people because the disability communities, just, it, not only is there a lack of information it's not cohesive. And a lot of misinformation is out there. And people are really trying to just pull it all together and, unfortunately there's just no one door to go through you. Can't just open the door and say, hi, I'm showing up. I have autism. What do I need to do to, access services and supports and put a life together. There's nothing like that. And this way. You can go through a little bit of a life map program with a group of cohorts. It's really it's meant for family members, primarily of young. Is that sort of where we are really proficient.

Pam:

And that's that's what, like you no longer the parent taking care of the little kid like that's such a need, it's a need in the mental health community, and it's a need in the disability community, hugely of those individuals that become legally become adults but don't have the, all the things they need in place because they can't live independently.

Annette:

Right. And it's the area that parents fear the most is that getting launched and I don't know. What do you think, Pam? I think this is going to be huge. I do too.

Pam:

I do too. I can see this being something that, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think about my, I have a I have a family member. I have a cousin that I was diagnosed like 19 with schizophrenia. So the mental health world and, my aunt and uncle are getting older and that's one of the things that they worry about is, I'm at 40, how old am I? 45. I'm like the youngest of all the cousins. So he's, I dunno my cousin's in his fifties. And so my aunt and uncle are in their eighties and it starts to become like a, what do we do? Is it gonna, is it gonna fall to siblings? Who's going to be responsible for making sure that he has everything he needs and then. Everything's provided for because the systems are just not, the systems are not doing it. So there has to be something that has to be, and there's a huge component of just like peace of mind that I have a plan in place that there's, that I have information now that I can access and do something with this. I absolutely think that's huge. I think that's so needed and amazing that you're doing that.

Annette:

And these are the things that we do every day in our law practice, but unfortunately, most of the people that come to. Are people who are wealthier and can afford to pay our fees. And we try to do as much pro bono as we can, but, again, I'm only one person in our law firms. There's only 10 of us that work in the firm, so we can't get to everybody. And we're only a Massachusetts. Yeah. We can actually, through this group coaching program, we can coach all over the country because it's not legally based. Right. It's based on. Concepts and I am so excited, I'm over the moon about it. And it's just another way to carry on our mission and to carry on the legacy of my daughter and the inspiration that she brought into my life. And where she's led me all this time.

Pam:

Yeah. It's so beautiful too. Like it's such a beautiful tribute to her to be doing this work.

Annette:

And I love being an entrepreneur. I was always that little. Who was selling stuff, door to door on the corner, nevermind the girl scout cookies. I was like making stuff and selling it everywhere in the neighborhood. The neighbors were so sick of me. They were like, oh no, here it comes in that again.

Pam:

That's awesome. There's so many entrepreneurs that I talk to have that same, have a similar story. And I was episode one of the podcast is my social media manager interviewing me. And she's were you that kid? And I was like no, I was not never everyone to own a business. I never, I wanted to be an Olympic figure skater. That was my dream. Oh, wow. I'm a far away from that. So it was just interesting. And I like our stories, but then they convert, things merged together and here we are as entrepreneurs. And so. Thinking about that idea of you as an entrepreneur, you being an entrepreneur, you having two companies, you having a law firm, you starting this other company at the start of 2020. You expanding into this group coaching program. How well, how did you balance work and life with. Two, small children, one with a disability. And how is that? How are you managing like the work-life balance? Because I mean, it would be easy. I would think if I were in your shoes and had all these things and were as passionate about the things as you are, I would work a hundred hours a week. Like how do you not work a hundred hours a week? How do you find that? How do you, what are the strategies that you've used to try to maintain some balance?

Annette:

Well, I'm going to tell you a little secret. Okay audience, are you listening? There is no such thing as work-life balance it's work-life integration and that's all that it is, you can't, there is no balancing and I'm sorry for all the guys out there that are listening. It's different when you're female, because. Most of us, not everybody, but most of us do have more of the childcare child rearing responsibilities. I was a single parent for most of those years. So I was running around, dropping off at dance. My daughter, Elizabeth had all the therapies and when the nurse didn't show up or the bus didn't come, like I had to do all of that. So there's no. Balance. It's working at all in together and integrating your life into one whole seamless thing. Once you get that and you figure out that's what it is, you can breathe again and it's not easy, but it's better.

Pam:

Yeah, that's Mindset.

Annette:

It is. And I actually think that this generation of parents, they get it more than we do. I totally see that in a much different way. My nephews are added because my sister older than I am, I have nephews that are kid raising now, and I see them there in the middle of the day. Playing with their kids, picking up kids, doing stuff they're not nine to five and yet it's just not that kind of world anymore. Yeah. And I think that's really awesome and cool. They're still stressed. They're still figuring it out. And I see the, my nephews and their wives are balancing it out and, doing things together in a way that we never. Yeah. So integration, not balance.

Pam:

Yeah. I love that. I love that. I love that shift in language and I think you're right. There is a recognition. I mean, my husband's, I always say I could not have run a therapy practice full-time and a coaching practice. Full-time I have a 13 year old are almost 13, but they're trying a few weeks. I could not have done that if I didn't have the husband that I have, who is like totally. I mean, he, they were out at karate while we were on this call. Did that takes her there. It does whatever. And he does all the work. He does all the laundry. He does all the cooking, but he just what are the things that I can do? He's I can't, see your clients for you. I can't do this work for you, but I can do let's figure out the things that I can do. And we figured that out long ago and why not? Yeah. We figured it out a long time ago that these are things that you're, and I'm terrible at I'm the person who puts the laundry in the washing machine and then forgets that. For three days. And then I'm like you underwear, what's going on? Didn't I just wash that, smell this bad. Like he's he'll leave for the day and he'll say, Hey, there's towels in the dryer and they're going to stop in about 20 minutes. Can you just turn the dryer back on when they're done? Can you text me and it maybe half an hour because I'm not going to remember. So, yeah, but I think there's a component of recognizing what your strengths are and just allowing, instead of it be like, this is what this gender does and this is, or this is what this role does or whatever it would be in being able to embrace. If you want clean clothes, don't ask me to do them. I'm capable of doing laundry. It just, if it's, if the washer and dryer were in my office, I'd have no problem, but then it would be loud, annoying, and I wouldn't want it to run because it would bother me. It would be

Annette:

got to let that stuff go. Yeah. I mean, when you're busy like that, but also when you're doing stuff you love. Yes. Why fill up your life with stuff?

Pam:

Correct. I'm like the, I actually set have said so many times we have a, we have somebody that comes and cleans the house and we were like dirt poor. Like we were like, but I was working a lot. He was working a lot. We had a little kid and I was like, I am not spending my Saturday cleaning the house. I'm hiring somebody to clean the house. And so we had somebody that cleaned the house and we have a new person now that cleans the house. I'm always like, well, she do her laundry and she's I mean, I can throw in loads, but I'm not here long enough to do all your laundry. Okay. I need a personal assistant come live with me and take care of those things. Cause I don't want to have to someday you'll be there soon. Yeah. I live in the limit. That'll be me living the dream you'll know and live in the dream. When I have somebody that comes and does my laundry for me. That's awesome. They have services. I know they do laundry out. I know, but I live in the middle of nowhere and you have. And well, not the middle of nowhere. I'm like a half an hour. If I were to take my clothes somewhere, send them out to be cleaned. It would be a 25 minute drive each way to do that. And I'm like, we have a washer and dryer. My husband's capable of doing the laundry. We're good. That's awesome. So do you have any words of wisdom, pieces of advice, tips, strategies, anything for our entrepreneurs that are out there trying to be of service, trying to show up, trying to live their passion, to be able to do that more. I don't know fully you'll do embrace that a

Annette:

little bit more. So I think it's hard sometimes just trying to figure out what that looks like, and so, and I'm not blowing smoke, but I firmly believe in coaching. So I have a business coach and I one of the first things I did when I woke up was I got myself a business coach. To try to get clarity around what am I trying to accomplish? I know I have this kind of idea that I wanted. Like I want to bring my business in more fully to really be some kind of Testament to. Elizabeth and my love for the families that I serve, but that's a big idea that has no no legs really. And there's I need to get my arms around it. So I hugely recommend even if it's for three months or six months, if that's all you can afford to ask around and find out who in your area is really good at this. And get yourself a coach and start, working on a plan for what that big idea can really look like for your business. What do you think about that? No,

Pam:

I think that's a, I think that's a great idea. I've always, I've worked through, I've worked with tons of coaches and mentors and coaches and more coaches through the years that I've been doing over the last 12 or 13 years that have been doing this stuff. And yeah, I think it helps to have somebody that you can go to that. Can really help you get clarity and conceptualize and figure out what's the strategy and where do I what do I do? Because often as entrepreneurs, we're good at ideas, big ideas. Oh yes. One of them, one of the hallmarks of entrepreneurship, right. Is like big. I know some people that are like, oh, I'll give you an entrepreneur. I've got all these big ideas or someone what to do with them. I'm like,

Annette:

yeah. Execution is so hard for most. Most of us are like add out the, of the wazoo. So that is a problem. Execution is really difficult, but also I think you just need to sit down and talk it through with somebody sometimes and the people around. They don't mean to be, but most people are pretty negative when you start talking to them about, I'm going to write a book and I'm going to start two companies and, and I want to, and I just, I bought an office building this year and, but when you start telling people that you're going to do these big. It scares them. Yeah. And they start worrying about you and worrying for you. And so sometimes it's best to go somewhere private with those thoughts and ideas first and work them out and have some concreteness about it before you bring them to your friends and family. Just make sure that you're picking a coach that has some reliability and some good, a good track record, and that you're not doing something that's more therapeutic. Then real business coaching. I mean, therapy has its place. It helped me, it was so important. And I did that first and then I got to the coaching piece, everything was segmented and had its place for me to get to this point. And that's the other thing too, is that nothing happens instantaneously and. Darn it in our society. We are very impulsive. People who want everything right now. I need this, I gotta do it today. I mean, it's eight years getting to this point for me. So I think, people just need to lay the foundation and be somewhat consistent and patient to in order to get. Getting to the next thing and the next thing and the next thing. And that can be hard. Cause we see, we're in an Instagram and Tik TOK world where I've got 2 million followers because I danced on Tik TOK and now I'm making a million dollars. It doesn't work like that for most of us. Especially. Old people. So we have to just work our steps. Yeah.

Pam:

Yeah. And I'd love that, that embracing that idea. Yeah. The I always say everything. I go back to middle school science, right. Everything happens on a bell curve. Right. And there's outliers that are, they're like, I started my business in March of 2020 at the start of COVID. And by July I was making$6 million a year, and I'm like, all right, I had already made$6 million. Okay, well, that's great, but like you're the exception, not the rule. That's cool. And when we start like putting ourselves up against that, we say God, I've been working on this, building this business for whatever three years. And I still am like struggling, or it's still like a side gig or it's still whatever. I think the recognition that like, yeah, but dedication and consistency and doing something that lights you up, doing something that you actually want to be doing, they're inspired to be doing. Oh,

Annette:

it's so good to run your own race and do what you love because then it's not work and you get up every day being happy. To be doing the work. That's what integration is all about then? You're you don't feel like I have to balance work and home when you're integrated into your life. It's all good. Yeah. Everything's good.

Pam:

Yeah. I was having this conversation with a friend. My daughter had a science project due on Monday, yesterday. That was most quote unquote, mostly done. And then on Sunday I said, Hey, what are you, what am I go through the checklist with you? And just make sure you have all the things. And she's well, all I left all the drawings at school. And and then, well, I don't have the details on this thing. And she, she's a. Almost 13. So she's not the fastest typer in the world. And she's like laying on the couch, hunting. I'm like, oh, I think that it was like we finished at nine 30 on Sunday night of everything's printed, everything's collated. You've written your cause. I'm like the, is your, is the P is there a page number on every page and is your last name on every page? And she's I have to do that. And I'm like, yes. I was a college professor. So I'm like, wow, all of these things, you're lucky. I'm not telling you that you need to write the title of your pro of your project on the bottom of that page, every single page. And so anyway the, I was super busy all Sunday, all of which was fine, but I woke up one Monday morning feeling like refreshed and like energized because I had, I wasn't frustrated with her. I was just like, oh, that's unfortunate. You thought you had a lot more done than you had done and that you forgot some things at school, take care of that. Not a big deal help you I'll support you in that process. But when you can learn how to integrate the two worlds together,

Annette:

Absolutely.

Pam:

It's so much better than cause there were, there probably would have been a time. There definitely would have been a time in my life. Had she done this? And the project not have been done the day before or whatever. I've been losing my shit.

Annette:

I get it. But you know, usually that's a reflection, not on what she's doing, but on something else going on with us, we're not happy other things going on. Our poor kids get the brunt of that. And I know that for a fact has happened with me, for sure. Well, I think that, overall the Alto, ultimately, if the audience can take one thing away from this conversation, I would love for them to just get that. If they have one good idea and passion that they want to follow, they should absolutely go for it because it's possible. It's more than possible. It's like really, honestly, probably the best thing that you should do. And it just takes a little bit of planning and a little bit of organization. And, maybe just stepping out into that fear a little bit to to just go for it, but the results are amazing and you don't have to make a million dollars or$6 million, like you said, or night in order to be happy with your life and be contributing. And, I meet some of the most amazing people, not just in the law firm. But, most of the good work that I do is not in the law firm. It's through the podcast and our Facebook live group, circle of care and our all things I do for free, by the way. And the, the people that we care for in our family services company. There's so many things that are all. Integrated into each other, so it's not just like standing up there and my lawyer suit, but all the other things that just brings so much to my life and I meet so many cool, amazing people out there in our community. And I just would not have it any other way. I couldn't even imagine what my life would be like without this in it. And I'm so glad I took that leap of. Even though COVID started about six weeks later. Right,

Pam:

right. Yeah. But on one hand it's oh man, COVID great. But on the other hand I think you, you spoke about it a little bit. Maybe it was before we got on the onto the podcast itself, but the isolation that exists already in the population with special needs. And then you put, COVID add COVID on top of that. Right? So you've got these families that are now isolated from the support systems that the, you know, the minimal support systems that they've had in place are now even more isolated because of their had family, or if they've had, social connections that have been able to support them, that stuff got ripped away.

Annette:

Right. And yes, making those connections is so important.

Pam:

Yeah, you guys are doing, you guys are doing some amazing work and I'm very excited.

Annette:

We're trying, and we have so much more to go and people are joining us because they're real excited with what we're doing. That's the great thing too, is that the community just is onboard and excited about what we're doing too. So all the connections we're making, it's amazing. And we're all sharing our stories together. So, and the podcast is going gangbusters to parenting impossible. It's been so fun. I love podcasts.

Pam:

I know I'm loving this, even though I'm like, my podcast is in its infancy. It hasn't even launched yet right at the time of this recording. But I'm absolutely loving this whole process. So, and meet

Annette:

the best people you meet. All the people that. Would have been your best friends if you had met them in person someday. And definitely people, you want to have coffee or a glass of wine with sometime.

Pam:

So when, if our audiences wanting to connect with you, how would they go about finding you.

Annette:

So most of our links are@specialneedscompanies.com, which is our main website that connects to the law group. It connects to special needs family services. There's a link there for our podcast or Facebook group circle of care. And there's a link to my book. Everything's right there. And I do a lot of speaking engagements and I'm here for you. People come in, come and talk to me. I love it.

Pam:

I will link all that stuff up in the show notes so that people are able to find you easily. I really appreciate you being here, sharing your story and sharing your expertise and just all the amazing things that you're doing. I'm super excited to see how that coaching program unfolds. Can't we can we to watch all that stuff bloom?

Annette:

Well, you are a gem and this podcast is just going to be awesome. You are going to knock it out of the park.

Pam:

Awesome. So if anything in particular is inspired you in this conversation please reach out to myself and that, and let us know. We are linked in the show notes and you can certainly tag us on Instagram or drop us messages and let us know how amazing you think. This whole story is so thank you guys for listening. I really appreciate you. And I will see you all next week.