The Peaceful Home

Episode 25: Radical Self Acceptance is the Key to Self-Love with Aubri Hathaway

May 06, 2022 Pamela Godbois
The Peaceful Home
Episode 25: Radical Self Acceptance is the Key to Self-Love with Aubri Hathaway
Show Notes Transcript

Have you ever felt like maybe the things you are struggling with are not REALLY your things? What if I told you that you are carrying with you baggage from generations past? In this week’s episode, we’re talking all about Radical Self-acceptance, self-love, and deep healing with Family System’s Constellation therapist, Aubri Hathaway. 


Aubri works as an International Systemic Arts Coach & Mentor where she weaves systemic and arts-based healing together with deep compassion practices. She teaches & supports helping professionals how to move toward radical self-acceptance and live more embodied free and empowered lives. She is also an artist, poet, yoga and mindfulness instructor, professional educator, and former occupational therapist and university tutor with over 20 years of experience in a variety of therapeutic and psycho-spiritual studies.


If this episode inspired you in some way, take a screenshot of you listening on your device and post it to your Instagram Stories and tag us, @pamgodboiscoaching and @aubri.hathaway.


In this episode you’ll hear:

  • Aubri will share the root of her deep desire of helping other people heal on their journey. 
  • How prevalent and important it is to look not just at your story, but the stories of your ancestors. 
  • The importance of doing your own healing work and the impact that has on your relationships and business. 
  • Aubri shares her own healing work and the impact that has had on her whole system and her relationships. 
  • She explores the path of sitting with the discomfort, accepting of self, the need for self-love, and what that creates in your life. 
  • That joy and celebration are the keys to creating a life that you can truly enjoy, and this comes in balance with the deep digging and healing work. 



LINKS:

Aubri’s Webiste: https://www.aubrihathaway.com


Aubri’s Instagram & Booking Link


Connect with me:  Instagram, Facebook, and Tiktok


If you’re like “I love listening to Pam chat with guests.” Then head over and write a review! We really appreciate your support and it helps us to keep growing!!  https://pamgodbois.com/ApplePodcast Thank you so much for listening to this week’s episode. Be sure to tune in next week.

The best thing you can do for yourself and your kids is effectively regulate your nervous system. And a great place to start >> to wire the brain for gratitude. Research tells us that gratitude increases happiness and a peaceful mindset. Make the shift and watch how things in your life start to change. Sign up today! www.pamgodbois.com/gratitude

Pam:

If you have been thinking that maybe it's time for you to do some shadow work. Maybe it's time to uncover. The old stories. The shit that keeps getting in the way. And maybe you're even wondering. Is this even my shit? You know, there's a good possibility that it's not. And if this has you thinking, then this episode is for you. I have the opportunity to sit down with Aubri Hathaway and we took a deep dive. Into these exact concepts. As well as the healing modalities that Aubri teaches and the practice to radical self love and acceptance. And I will just warn you. We could've talked for hours. And as a matter of fact, Since this recording, we have. This is not an episode that you want to miss. Let's dive in. Well, thank you Aubri, for being here with me today. I'm so excited that we've finally been able to connect and have you on the podcast.

Aubri:

Thank you. Yeah.

Pam:

So we were chatting a little bit before we got on we having these, these parallel histories, being therapists and embodiment and embodiment practitioners, and, And, and I'll be in your work stuff. And I would love if you would share with our audience, your story of how you, cause you're not a therapist anymore either. So how your story and how that is all evolved for you throughout your life?

Aubri:

I feel this is reminding me of a time I was in Bali and we had to do. I was in a writing group and it was like, my life began when, and then it was, you just picked a moment in time, right? This is like the story. What is, where do you start? Yeah, I think I'm going to start in, in the present moment right now, actually. I, I feel so passionate about I'm going to call it like radical self-acceptance and the journey that got me to that has been pretty full on, but there's so many things we can do on this path as people who are seeking healing or who are practitioners of all sorts of health and wellness stuff. But my life didn't really change until. I stopped trying to fix myself and you, and you go to school, it's all about fixing the things, so many things. And I found this beautiful healing happening for people and for myself in spaces where there was no agenda where every part of you was allowed to belong. And I saw this happening across different things from yoga to. Maybe certain healing modalities I did, but just the places where that happened, I felt relief. I felt oh, okay. Something can, can actually naturally shift it. Doesn't have to be forcefully, forcefully changed. And so I started wanting to study more of that. So the two things that I really sit in now is I am a practitioner for family and systemic constellations, and I do a lot of work with nonviolent communication or people call it compassionate communication. And then I've studied. I'd say, all the different, maybe possibilities around what sits in that space. I think that's probably a really common. I dunno, name like a lot of people know about NBC, but I've studied empathy with lots of different teachers, like audio Shanti and Kristin Neff and Kelly, Kelly, McGonigal. Yeah. Just I just love that stuff. So I'm always looking for different ways. And I do feel like even though there's all these beautiful, different modalities and research and processes, I don't think it's something you can trademark. Yeah. And so it's, it's, it's part of being human and it's a natural thing that we can really access, but then there are also some skills you can cultivate to, to help that. So, that's where I sit now, with the work that I do now, it's really about facilitating. Connection cultivating this capacity for compassion and radical self-acceptance. And through that, having that ability to have embodied living, feeling like you can be in yourself and be with all your parts. And I remember one day, I think it was maybe a year and a half ago after doing a bunch of family constellations on myself, actually I looked in the mirror and it was like, wow, I can see. So many more aspects of who I am with open-heartedness and I don't just see somebody who's wounded, which a lot of people wouldn't necessarily necessarily have thought that I would have felt that way about myself, but I have a lot of trauma in my history. So I, there was, someone's looking in the mirror looking at old pictures, it was, there was just this feeling there and that just softened, it just softened so much. So now I'm kind of like, I want to really offer that for myself. That's part of what I continue to do with myself and with other people. Yeah. And I'm finding my brain is I don't know what to tell you about my story. I don't know. There's so many things, so maybe we can find a question to take me somewhere. Yeah, for

Pam:

sure. So what was it. That made you decide to become a therapist?

Aubri:

Yeah. Okay. So, when I was a kid, I was really intuitive and I think if you're into archetypes and Carl Young and all that, and I also love Carolyn Meese, I would say that I've always had that sort of healer archetype, and my brother's friends would call and my brother's eight and half years older than me. And I answered the phone and I would just like, no something was going on and I might even know details. And I ask a question and I ended up spending 15 minutes on the phone with someone who was like 10 years old. And he'd be like, gosh, I feel so much better. Okay. I'll get my brother now. And it was just this kind of stuff happened a lot. It happened with my friends at school when I was in high school. I remember. Yeah, just facilitating a lot of intuitive healing with people and, and knowing things about them and being able to stay stuff. And they go, how did you know that? How did you understand that? I don't, I didn't tell you or these kinds of things. So there was just this intuition I always had, and then there was some kind of, yeah, I'd say an archetypal energy that I just naturally was counseling people all the time. And then I had a lot of stuff happened in my family. There was a lot of stuff. Lots of different things that had to be overcome. With mental health, my mom struggled with mental health. My dad had some of his own health issues and there was a point where I, we were even struggling with homelessness and I had to find places to live. And I was separated from my family. And I remember thinking I just would love to help people. So, if they go through what my family went through, they know they're not alone. They have someone there. So there was like the life experience combined with that natural ability came together. And I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I remember when I was 18, I started writing down ideas and I described a role where I didn't want to just be a psychologist and I didn't want to be a doctor. And I wanted to work with the whole person. And I wanted to help them optimize their life. Somehow I just wrote that down. I ended up studying, cause I love art. I ended up studying art and then I went into art history and then I went into sociology. And then from there I ended up getting recruited. To go into the occupational therapy department and was weird, was, so this was maybe five years later, the logo or the slogan for that year was like helping people optimize their life. And it was what I had written down, when I was younger and it was like, oh, you can work with any age group and you don't have to just be in a hospital and you can work in a clinic or a school. And so it just felt like the first time I, something felt. As though it was an aha, this is the thing. So, I decided to continue on with my schooling and I got my master's in occupational therapy and that's how I ended up in that role. And, and in between there, which I left out with, I dropped out of high school because of the stress and the trauma. I actually went to junior college, which we have in the states. They don't really have that where I live now. But yeah. And so I was studying, some different things to figure it out. And very luckily was able to transition with my AA degree. And I got a scholarship to go into college, into uni to get my bachelors. And then, yeah. And then onto the map and yeah, it just made a lot of sense for me to have something. And what I loved about at the time the occupational therapy profession, where I went to school, it was so holistic. And in our practice framework, they talk about spirituality and culture and all these different aspects that affect us as humans. And, uh, because the occupational therapy field came out of the arts and crafts movement back in the day, there was a lot of creativity. So in school I did things like mindful mosaic making and Ikebana flower ranging like Japanese firing day. And we did do different things. And then we would do task analysis to look at how this is helping on a physical level or on a mental level. So I just really liked that. And so that's how I ended up in that therapy. Arena. Yeah.

Pam:

Wow. That's pretty cool. Just thinking, just hearing about the kind of stuff that you've got to study school. I was like, Hey, I want to go do that.

Aubri:

I know it was really good. Not every university does that. I was really lucky. We had a pretty, creative department and, and that was cool. And and then, yeah, at the uni that I was at, they developed a program called lifestyle redesign that I got to do my residency and it's one of my residencies for my hours. And, looking at it was, it was looking at our lifestyle and all these different things. So I always say that OTs are the original life coach, but yeah. And, and then what happened for me is so because of stuff that I've had to go through and being highly sensitive, All of that. I also started to develop, which we know now from ACEs and things like that, like health issues. So, I had stomach issues. I had all these like inflammation, itis and diagnoses, and I was kinda getting passed around medical offices, nobody talking to each other, just yeah, there's nothing there, but it's inflamed this kind of thing. Right. And so in my personal journey, when I finally found these kind of compassion practices and some of these yoga practices and NBC and different things that helped me to be with myself and start to make peace with my past. And my body started to heal. And so I had, at one point, I don't know if it was eight or 10 different diagnoses, and then I would go back into the doctor and they'd go, oh, oh, it's gone. You don't have to come back. Now. They never asked what did you do? Right. Right. It changed this situation. We were going to do surgery on you, but it's gone now. They just went, okay, just come back a few months. We'll make sure everything's still okay. And then it just stayed. Okay. So, for me, it was this very as I grew in myself and saw how a lot of the things I was in taught in school or helping me heal emotionally and physically, I really wanted to start to share those with people. So I started doing work privately as a coach, outside of my therapy business, years ago, just here and there, oh, let's just see and, and it, and then it just started happening more and more aware. Uh, my colleagues would go, you are so different. You've really changed. What are you doing? Can we do something at lunch? So I found myself again, naturally being in that sort of council role, but I wasn't, it wasn't therapy per se, right. It was maybe doing some kind of mindfulness or self connection or forgiveness exercise. And that just kept, I kept going. This is more and more of what I want to do. So I started moving away from the. Clinical stuff and more and more towards what I experienced in my life and through my direct experience with other people as these more simple, but very, very powerful ways of shifting my relationship with myself, with my health, with, with other people. And I just kept seeing my relationships change and I kept saying, myself change in ways that I wasn't seeing through other resources that I had through other therapies I was getting. So then I, yeah, I wanted to study more of that stuff.

Pam:

Yeah. As you're, as you're talking about, your doing this work, you doing your own inner work, your own healing work whatever the modalities are. And we can talk a little bit more about that, some of those modalities, but the, as you're doing that work with people on the outside of you are recognizing that there's a shift and they're like, they're drawn to that. This is the, this is the, the human connection, how we are as human beings thing. Right. But that we all want to feel good. We want to feel physically, emotionally, spiritually good, whatever good means, right. To each of us. And when we're not where you're seeking, we're looking to see like, how can I, how can I have a better experience here? And when you are someone, whether it's purposeful uh, I'm telling people about this as it's part of my business, or whether it's just like part of your own journey that people have in to you witnessing there's a lot of power in our own transformation.

Aubri:

A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, uh, like just one of the gifts, I feel so grateful for. I think it's been 15 years now when I first started studying with Marshall Rosenberg and studying non-violent communication and doing some of the books and like the workshop. And then I started sharing it with my colleagues and they've all gone on to run their own groups. And then there are people who've gone on to run their own groups. And then this year I ran I hosted, I should say like a 12 week program. Again, that's from another NBC book called ongo, which I absolutely love anyone can buy it. They're updating it right now. And it's it. You can do individual, uh, couples or two people or a group, and it's all in there and it's guide guide you through the whole thing. And again, just even the other day, I have had people emailing me saying that how much just being introduced to that work has changed their life. They're just so grateful and. I usually do at least one or two classes in that sort of paradigm every year for myself. And I always learn something new. I'm always learning. I'm always going, wow. I didn't know that. Or yeah, that pushed my edge or that's a wonderful, different way of, describing that situation. So I feel. Really, I love being a learner that way. And I'm really aware of as much as I know, there's still so much that I don't and I just signed up for another training a short one, not, not a crazy expensive one. I have been on learning addict and I've made a really big commitment to myself to stop actually taking courses for a while now and just use free resources and integration with people. I've got, if you saw the red, I don't even have it on my website anymore. I was like, this is too long. I'm just taking all of these trainings off. There's too many. But you know that, you're saying, when you do the work, you inspire others. And so. They go, oh, I want, I want that too. And, but that the, their willingness to then do that. And I love that a lot of the things I've studied, there's a lot of great resources out there and you don't have to pay thousands of dollars necessarily to do this work. Right. I think one of the things that I am aware of which OT having the OT mine, that'll always be a part of me has helped, is it's the little changes on a regular everyday basis that make a really big long-term impact. And sometimes we want to have these huge shifts, but, if I. Didn't put if I didn't eat cheese every day, I always, I used to eat a lot more cheeks. So, it's these little lifestyle changes and suddenly you're like, oh, well, my digestion's much better. Actually. I'm sleeping better over time. Right. These little things. And if I decide, instead of trying to do every single thing and learn all the things and do all the workshops, if I just go imagine if you spent one year with just one intention coming back to it every day and the other a few weeks ago, actually I had this thought of going, w what if before I open my mouth and do anything, I just asked myself, what am I going to accomplish by doing this? And what is my intention? Is it going to be helpful? And is it going to be moving me towards what that, what I value? What, what matters? What if I took a breath and just connected to that before I did anything. And I did that every day for a year. Imagine how much my life would change. I haven't done it. I haven't done it for you, but I did do it for about a month. And I was like, wow, this is, I just, every time I went to type something, I just stopped or respond, especially social media. Right. Just stop. What am I going to accomplish by doing this? How's it going to help me? How's it going to help them that one little thing. So, when it comes to self compassion for me, it's what if I just set the intention that I didn't have to get rid of any of me, any of my parts, any of the things that I might, I might really want to take care of? Like the wounded side or the sensitive side, but what if I also didn't have to get rid of the critical stuff? What, if I could understand it better. And through that, find a way to have a different relationship. And then because of that, the critic might decide to use its energy differently, which is what I've experienced. Yeah. And so I, I can, if I just had that one intention, I don't have to have lots of following scripts. I can just be with me if I just came with that every day, I'm like, okay, wow. So much more room to breathe. So much more room to be human. And then for me, like the by-product is the roll on effect. It's then I'm more compassionate for other people. I'm able to be more honest, I have more integrity in my relationships, all these different things, less stress because I'm not at war inside of my own mind, which is to be really good at really, really good at that. And that was one of the dangers too. I think, of having trauma and also being on somewhat of a spiritual path. Th some aspect of me was like, we're going to do all the things and get rid of all the stuff and you bypass, we bypass what needs healing. And I just, I found something landed one day, the penny dropped. It was like, no, actually you can just welcome it all. You can hold it all. And when you're flooded with parts that feel really hard. Like when I have stuff come up from my childhood, I, I have this sense of at the same time I'm feeling maybe overwhelmed, also feeling empowered because I know how to nurture and care for that part of me, instead of freaking out on top of the freaking out, like I did when I was in my twenties and I'd have a panic attack and then I'd be going to be like this forever, and then when we, it would be over, but then I spend days, like whatever it was, if it was shaming myself for being in fear about it happening again, now it's Hey. Stuff. I love you. I'm here. I got you. We got this girl and then I'm like, okay. I, they, but then I like put my hand on my chest and I'm breathing and I may be doing some real polyvagal stuff and putting my hands on the back of my neck and massaging my biggest nerve. And I'm like, we know how long this is going to last, it's not forever. We can breathe and it's totally okay. And I get through it and I can function. And so my life grows around these things instead of having to eliminate them. And I think it's the same. It's just reminded me of with grief. It's you don't just get rid of it. Like it, it softens as. You hold it and your life grows around it. And so that's been, for me, a huge part of my journey is learning how to have that, those, that deeper sense of self-acceptance and I'm still learning. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. I love

Pam:

the concept of the things that you're talking about. And you're talking about being in relationship because they're reminding me of things like, when you want to have good communication or are good, cook a good relationship with somebody in your life, the things that you do, right? Like how many times have we had, somebody said something to us, oh, a loved one that said something that you want to, you want to respond back to because it's triggered you, it's pissed you off in some way. And, but you're like, okay, is that gonna. I have this, this is my, I have a 13 year old and I have a husband has also, is this the best course of action here? Probably not, but it's interesting that we can do that outside of ourselves because the, the reaction is immediate, right. Especially of a 13 year old, 13 year old daughter. So, the reaction is immediate. If I pushed back on

Aubri:

her, she pushes back on me right away.

Pam:

Right. And so, and that's almost like the internal that internal shit you're talking about. Right. These conversations is stuff. That's old stuff. It's like having a conversation with your 13 year old.

Aubri:

Yeah, totally. And sometimes I draw, I love art stuff. Sometimes I draw what's happening inside of me. Sometimes I draw the energy sometimes if it feels like a more of a conceptualized part, I'll draw the part. And that sounds all write letters. And, I bring in, this is a little bit of I'll do what I call an art space constellation. We didn't talk about what constellation work is, but thing like constellation work like. Can bring in resources and healing. So I'll put it out on the page. And then I bring in the stuff that I want to make it look better and feel better. And then when you look at the picture that's healed, your body has a physical response. You have a neurological shift and it's and I like that, but I think I want to, I want to mention so important. I'm talking about how I can do this. Now. I have been in therapy and off and on and on a spiritual path and practicing self-compassion and practicing these different things for 20 years. And, and so it's take the pressure off of having to do it right. Or knowing, and depending on your situation or your background or where you're growing up, there's a lot of thickly. There are some people who are more privileged to be able to go into these places and have regular practices where they can be regulated. I didn't grow up in that kind of environment. I was constantly dysregulated. And as an adult, I really had to learn how to trust my body again, trust my intuition again. And so while there are some healing modalities that can really help shift certain things quite quickly, There is a long-term relationship that we have to cultivate with ourself. And so it's not about going again somewhere to fix it and take the box off. It's about going, I am going to live with one person for the rest of my life and that's me. And so instead of looking around everywhere else and for everyone else to fix me, or, or me fix them, if I'm codependent, like I used to be recovering. Right. And it's like waking up and going, okay, who's the first person that I have to look at in the morning. It's actually me. And so what am I going to commit to? And how am I going to keep checking in with me so that I can have a healthy relationship there first and. How do I allow him some self-acceptance and how do I allow him some understanding and, and where is my capacity? Where's my limit. And where can I maybe ask for help where there's some willingness for it to be given. And there's lots of free resources out there. So it's not about it looking one. Because we have to take into consideration a lot of different things. When we're looking at our healing. I come from a mixed background and my father from, from what I know from him and from his stories, he shared, we don't have any documentation. A lot of our, uh, I'd say our ancestral documentation was destroyed, but. Our lineage is, uh, mixed on his side. So there's indigenous native American and European indigenous. And then my mom's side, there's like a couple of different types of Latin American and also some European. And my grandparents on my mom's side were refugees. They came over and there were also people in their faith and my mom's side of the family who were Holocaust survivors on my father's side, there's the potential of this trauma from the native American, uh, genocides and things like that, that happened. And so I've had in my life. A lot of things, people wouldn't even understand where I wa I used to grow up having the weirdest reactions to things for no reason, freaking out about stuff. Once I started learning about ancestral trauma and ancestral healing and intergenerational transgender, I went oh, okay. Right

Pam:

now. Okay.

Aubri:

Yeah. So this is why I started studying and doing family constellation therapy, therapies, or facilitations with different people. I've worked with lots of different teachers over the last 15 years. And first it was kind of like, I was just going to workshops and, and doing some one on ones. And then I just naturally went, I really want to facilitate this, but you know, when I acknowledged stuff from my grandparents, I'll give you a crazy, crazy story since we're just chatting about all the weird things. So I don't know, maybe it was two years ago. I went away on this trip and I got bit by a mosquito and I got, I had a couple of bites is pretty itchy. And then I started getting hives and then it started spreading and I was like, what in the world is going on? Start spreading all over my legs and all this business. And so I got, I took some anti-histamines didn't work, went to the doctor, got some more stuff, got some creams didn't work. This was going on for months. And I was. Upper year constant leader in our, in our frame of reference or our, our sort of model. We go, oh, when something doesn't resolve spite, all possible interventions and all medical interventions, that's usually systemic. There's something in the family that's needing to be acknowledged. And I know for some people that sounds really crazy, but I did it. it's hard to conceptualize say that it's a nice way. It's hard to understand if you haven't seen it yourself. And even me telling the story, it's did that really happen? But yes, it did. I did a little constellation for myself, ask my partner if he would, he would participate cause you with the process, you have representations for things. And anyways, I ended up having acknowledged stuff from my grandparents, from when they were in the Holocaust and the next day my hives went away. Yeah. It's you're

Pam:

like, there's no way. There's

Aubri:

no way that,

Pam:

that, like at that time you had all these medical interventions had all these, like just magically overnight,

Aubri:

just coincidentally it resolved. So has this happened a few times with different symptoms? And I've seen it with clients. And so for me, I've had to do a lot of ancestral healing, like a lot, because not just from my grandparents and my great-grandparents, but also my parents had stuff, they had a lot of stuff. My mom suffered with depression and fibromyalgia and, uh, different traumas. And there was just, there's just stuff in my family system. And then whatever, I, whatever came from that. So then you look at the childhood I had because it was, we had some financial hardships and mental health stuff, and the thing is there was always love in my family, but there was just a lot of challenge. Yeah. And I think in doing a lot of the work I've done, I've been able to see and receive that love now. So there's no longer like a little girl going, oh, I didn't get the love. I need it. It's actually I feel totally loved. I feel sad that some of the other needs couldn't be met because of the stressors in our life. But I have so much compassion for people because I get what it's like to be there, in those situations. But there is a lot of stuff we don't realize we carry that is legacy burdens, ancestral burdens, and. It affects are so many things, are unconscious behaviors, patterns. We see that we keep repeating, but can't change despite years of therapy, it's like this kind of stuff. So I find this like this mix of like deep compassion with having a process to actually be like, is this really mine? Did this start with me. It was like my mom's or maybe it was a great grandparent or something. Uh, and also just having, a way of living where you understand the interconnectedness and how important it is to have resources and love and support. And. Things to belong, not to be exiled, not to be cut off. And right now we're seeing so much of that happening in the world and my experience as a therapist and as a practitioner and as a human is when we cut things off because more suffering and it comes back down the line. So actually the hardest thing to do is to face it and to meet it and to try to understand it. And, and sometimes it's not always about getting it the way you want it, but it's going, this is how it is. This is this is as much as that can be done. And I accept that and, but I acknowledged that this is all connected to. Yeah. And that's been really helpful for me because I've had a lot of, yeah. I had a lot of weird symptoms. It'd be like, yeah, go to the doctor, nothing works. And then I, so my own person, again, my own personal journey pushed me to learn this stuff because nothing else was working. So I have this beautiful connection to these resources. Now I understand how they work for me. And I, yeah. If I hadn't had some of my strange and wild experiences, I wouldn't have understood the capacity for this stuff to help, but I think everyone's different and everyone has a different journey and. If, if I can appreciate that for you and for someone else if we can all walk our path and listen to our hearts, then there's a, like a lot of people can have the freedom to do what they're meant to do and to use their gifts in the ways they're meant to, instead of trying to be like everyone else or fit in like everyone else. And I remember for so long, just wanting to be quote unquote normal, but as I've developed that capacity to understand my inner world and how I relate to my outer world, I feel stronger now. So I can feel more. I suffer less. And I have that strength to ride the waves, which I I'll say there is still a little part of me inside. That's but can we just not have any more waves right. When you've had a lot of waves, but the truth is, and again, that's this coming back to acceptance. There will always be waves in life. It will be the big ones and the small ones. So if I have capacity to be with that, I can just navigate my life so much more freely and easily. And it doesn't mean it's not uncomfortable sometimes, but I'm definitely less at war with myself, which means I can do more. I can show up more for my work for my, for my, my partner, for my friends, all of those kinds of things.

Pam:

Yeah. So in thinking about we have listeners out there that are like, yeah, but that's nice. That's nice for you, but I'm still at war with myself. Like how do I get to a place of this radical self-acceptance that you're talking about? What, what are some, do you have any tips or strategies to start doing some of that

Aubri:

work? For sure. I think, well, for me, I think something that is helpful for me. And when I first started, I first started with creating an intentional space. Depending on where I lived, it might've been in my car. Like maybe I leave, 10 minutes earlier and I go find a spot to park somewhere quiet. Or it's a, it's a corner in my room or now yeah, I have a space where I live, where you're like, this is my space to be with me. And sometimes having a physical item to create an energetic, like a symbolic shift into a space could even be helpful. So, I have a teacher who always has this little scarf. She wears, then it's like her little comfy things. Like she can put that on. And it's okay, this is my way of connecting back to myself. And, I have friends who are in yoga and they have little tiny statues. They like to carry. So wherever they travel, they set that up on a window and it's I'm going to sit and be here with myself. This is my reminder. I sometimes we'll do that symbolically with, uh, clients. So we've gone I've made friendship bracelets with clients, so they make a French-based bracelet for themselves. I, my own best friend or you have something physical. Right. So any kind of physical symbol. Reminder kind of thing. And and the space is the first start. And then, and then can you invite yourself to be with yourself in that space? That sounded weird. Invite yourself to be with yourself, but yeah, and, and to just do, just acknowledge where you're at to start with just witnessing where you're at and, and to, to have the conversation, Hey, Hey, how you doing? Yeah. I'm, I'm not going to get rid of you, I'm listening today and just being with yourself. And if you just set that intention and maybe it's for five minutes in the morning and for five minutes a night to just check in and be like, I'm here, I'm listening. And I'm not avoiding, I'm not pushing you. I'm not getting rid of yet. It could be that simple. Yeah. I find that some people love writing, so journaling can be really helpful. And but there's sometimes there's a need for oh, but I just need something, some kind of process, like a guided process. And what could that look like? So I do a thing where I go don't know. I came up with this years ago. I was just like, what am I doing with myself? That's helping me. So I wrote it down. So it was like, I start with in my little space or even then I do it as a micro meditation. I call it during the day I, I witnessed, just what am I feeling in my body right now? What are the sensations. And I feel tight. Do I feel is my heart racing as I do. I have a headache and my light in some places and just witnessing it without judging it as good or bad, like not without going off. I wish I didn't have this fucking headache. I'm fucking sick of feeling like this. I it's just okay, I feel like this. I'm just noticing it. And then I acknowledge what's happening. So if I say to my body or to maybe if it's a clear part of myself, like I noticed this, I might go, how old do I feel right now? I feel 14. So maybe it's the 14 year old energies come up. I'll go. I am. I notice you. I acknowledge you. I can really feel the tightness in my body. I can feel, that the pressure in my head and the worry and the concern. And I just I really hear that this is how you're feeling. Right. And I talked to myself and then And then I sit instead of just trying to fix it. Right. And this took years, like when I first started studying NBC, I wanted to just jump straight to this. It's really hard to just be with, to be with it. So I sit, so I acknowledge it. I, I witnessed, so I witnessed it, I acknowledge it. And then I just sit with it for a little bit and I breathe and I just notice how just breathing and being with those sensations and those emotions, just my being knows. Okay. I'm, I'm not alone in a sense. I'm with myself, I'm connecting to something in any little minuscule way I can to care for this energy inside of me. And then after that I will offer empathy and that might be like going, oh, on, are you feeling like this? Are you feeling like that? Yeah, it must be really hard for you. And a good example will be one day I was just, I felt so embarrassed and awkward after this long meeting I had late at night and I was like, and I was practicing this intentionally for a year and I went okay. It's okay. Yeah, let's just break it. I was breathing and then I, okay. You're feeling really tired. You're feeling really upset. I wonder what else has happened today? And then I was like, oh, you didn't sleep well last night and you skipped lunch and this happened. And that happened, of course you're feeling tired, sweetheart. Of course, now I need to feel that don't judge yourself for that. That makes sense. So, and then my whole body relaxed because I was being nice to myself, my whole body, oh, this is working. This practice is working like this practice. So, and then I go into a bit of inquiry. So it might be, yeah, like what else happened today? Or what's needed here right now? Or what can I do for you? What do you need for me? I don't necessarily going, what do you need someone else to do? Because if we attach the need to a specific strategy or outcome, it might, or person who might not be able to have it met. So it's just kinda what's needed, right. What is what's happening? And then the last thing is okay, is there an action I can take? And so even if I just did that little reflection process every day for 15 minutes or 30 minutes in the morning and night, like that is such a great place to start building connection to yourself and then seeing, if you're honoring the needs in your life and I do it too, when I'm happy. Cause then I'll notice, oh, my needs were really met. I feel like. Great. And so what were, what was being met today? Why was I better? What was happening that allowed me to feel more full? And so you're not just focusing on where there's gaps. We're also focusing on where. There's connection. And as you build that awareness, you start to notice over time. What helps you and what doesn't help you instead of just following a script of do these things to make yourself feel better, because these are the top 10 things that everyone's doing right now, because I might be tired, but I might have a need for energy. And so I want to go and run or eat better food, or I might be tired and I might have a need to rest. And if I pick a different strategy, just because it's like, what's popular, I'm actually not meeting my need. Right. You're defeating the whole purpose. I'm definitely feeding the whole purpose. And I'm just, again, like ignoring myself. So, so I think, yeah, like a place to start could just be creating a space and taking time to listen inside. That process we went through, you can, people can do something like that. Or you could do something as simple as just being like, I'm just going to sit here and breathe with myself and I'm gonna get to hug myself. I like the physical touch and I'm going to breathe and I'm going to listen to nice music and just let whatever's here, be here instead of trying to get rid of it. Just notice what happens when I, when I do that. And I maybe, maybe talk to it with a nice voice. And so what would that naturally look like for you? What would it, what would it naturally look like for you to talk nicely to anyone else, to your, your kid, your friend, your dog, maybe even write some examples down of what that might sound like, and then just practice doing that with yourself.

Pam:

I love that. And I think that, I tend to, and maybe it's because of my mom, I tend to end up with a lot of moms, like jumping in and doing work with me. And there is that it's very clear. It's very clear for women, but it's, and then being a mom compounds the clarity, the clarity at which we go, yeah, I'll do that for everybody else, except not for me.

Aubri:

Oh yes. Oh yes. I did a survey with my clients this year. I have so I work with a lot of health practitioners, but almost all of them are moms. And that was the most common like issue was I put myself last. I w I actually cried the day I got all of my responses back. I was in tears because I just, I see all these people is so amazing, so amazing. I see all these IP, I see people's gifts. I see their capacity. I see their love, their, their amazingness, and that. Skewed perception from multiple different reasons. Right. And, but I'll say from doing this kind of work right with people, which you, you do too. Oh, it's so nice when that shifts and I'd actually had a text from a client this morning who was like, I finally did the hard thing. Right. And she like had a conversation that was challenging and she put herself first and she's thank you so much. And and she's gone on to do some extra trainings too, in these things. And she couldn't have done that a year ago, and it's scary, but she's she's stepping in and she's doing the things she's saying, no, he sat in the boundaries putting herself first and yeah. And what I find too with moms now, since we mentioned moms is like a lot of the times when they start practicing stuff, It's so cute. The kids will hear it because it's in the house and they're sponges and I'll get called that all my stuff came up to me today and he said, mommy, are you feeling sad and tired? And do you need to have a cuddle and arrest? And would you like me to help you lay down? And I can massage your forehead. It's they hear this, this kind of dialogue and they actually start to model it back and then you're yelling. You're going, oh my gosh. Yes, actually, thank you for helping me see what I've been ignoring.

Pam:

Yeah. And not to mention what that does from a neurological perspective for there, for our children. Talk about this intergenerational trauma and these things, these old stories that are, that are passed on from generation to generation to generation. And, and if we could all just be the person. In our lineage that just heals that shit so that we don't have to pass it to the next. Right. And doing some of this work, regardless of how, of what that work looks like doing some of this work. And just being able to have those conversations with yourselves, that your kids are overhearing that there they are sponges and they start talking to themselves differently, or they get to the age where they're like minds. I've been doing this stuff forever as well. And mine's almost 13. And I hear her talking to her saying stuff

Aubri:

like this to her friends like that.

Pam:

Like maybe, I mean, I know, I, I think that you're overwhelmed and you just need a break and I'm like,

Aubri:

I'm talking to, I love it. I love it. So it's, I dunno, I think it's rich and it's important. And it's, and it makes a difference, like you said, and I'm really aware of this sort of, I guess now I don't know. The research has saying, seven generations. Before and after, right. So what we're doing now will affect seven generations after us, if the lineage continues. Right. I think it's possible even more than that. But we, we often don't think that way, we don't think how is what I'm doing right now, going to affect seven generations from now, how many years does that? I mean, think about that ripple effect. And so it's not just about all, I think a lot of times from past cultural beliefs, it's like, how do I please, my parents, how do I do this or that? And we have lots of loyalties and things and we can sacrifice lots of things too. I feel like we belong to a family system, but it's, it's, it's like healing some of that and also going, but actually how, if I am having kids or even just want to be a model to the kids in the community around me, how do I want to show up for what's in front of me? So they look up and go, that's actually, that's the model. That's the inspiration. And how do we then leave that so that they can be empowered and they can move ahead in their life. And that's why I think ancestral healing is important because we have to honor the amazing gifts of our ancestors, but also it's really important to unburden the things that we've been carrying that aren't ours. And it's not just so that we're getting rid of anything. It's. So we're handing it back to the point of responsibility where it needs to be healed for them, because when you heal, like if someone gives you something that's yours and you can finally heal it and take care of it, you feel empty. Yeah. So in that sense, on an energetic level, on a, on an ancestral level, making that piece also helps our ancestors be at peace. So it's, it's again, it's not about getting rid of, or like checking something out that we don't want to deal with. It's it's creating order and allowing things to align so that there can be. Love and compassion and connection passed on through the generations and then in the community. So like you said, then the kids are doing it with their friends and you're like, oh wow. Did you just say that? Right. Look at you.

Pam:

Yeah. Yeah. It is crazy. It's crazy that the, especially when we don't realize the impact that we're having, right. We're doing, we're, we're experiencing our world in whatever way it is. And we've been through the whole COVID and isolation and disconnection and all that stuff. And we're seeing mental health issues with kids on the rise. And part of that reason for that is because there were, there was a buffer, there has not been a buffer. Right. And that doesn't even have to be in a household. Like I always say, like I grew up, I didn't grow up in there. Wasn't like a, in my. In my household, my parents, my siblings there wasn't trauma there. But now as a, like doing the work that I've done for however many years I've been doing this, now I can see like the trails of tr like it's these smoke trails of trauma all around, like somehow my parents, uh, and they both had their own shit, but like somehow they were like, no, not on our watch. That was the thing that they would change. They worked really hard at. And, and, and yet even with that, there's so many things that we internalize and we hang on to because we don't know what we don't know.

Aubri:

What's popping into my head about this, I think is really important too. I've noticed in my, in the therapy community and maybe in healing in general, it's become really popular to talk about trauma and trauma healing and this type of stuff. But something I think that's really important is to not just be digging all the time. And so there's some people maybe listening who are realizing, oh, it'd be good for me to do a bit of personal, personal work, but there's also people who are, it's all they're doing and their needs when we build our life. If, if we don't include joy and celebration, which are the things we're hoping to receive by doing the healing, we we're, we're not going to experience it. So we also need to have, again, like creating a life around the things and for people who've had more severe trauma or mental health challenges, there are sometimes does need to be long-term ongoing support, but there can also be just in general, people getting sucked into. Seeing too many, I was one of these people. So seeing too many therapists and doing too many things. So my new thing last the last few years is taking me a while to really reprogram this, to create space for that, where I'm going, I'm going to have friends over and we're going to have a taco night and we're going to do some dancing and I'm going to have we're gonna, I'm going to go camping with some girlfriends and just these other things. And I'm gonna, I love playing with Play-Doh. So, because I used to do some expressive therapies, I just, I love the feeling of it. And so sometimes it's, I invite adults to do these things that we don't in quotes allow ourselves to do. You can I, my clients sometimes will, I'll bring some of this into the sessions to invite a playfulness, but also there's something so healing about using your hands and doing things creatively, not to make it look like something just takes experience like we did when we were little and we were in the mud and just feeling it and squishing it and making it and how do we add that flavor of whatever that looks like to us and move into sharing our own unique gifts with people in our circle of connection, however, small or big that might be, that might be for some, you work with lots of moms being just such a beautiful mom. And if you're taking care of yourself, bringing more joy into your life, you're happier for your kids. And for other people, they have a lot of roles or they're, running a company, whatever we all have to do. Sizes of ripple effect of community, the micro and the macro. So, in your own unique situation, how can you bring in more joy and celebration? How can you find things to saver? I don't know how, but I used to have a lot of digestion issues and I'd done all the things. So I know all the doctors did all the natural stuff, everything, and I've just came to the terms of this is actually, it was related to my family and stress. My mom passed away over the holidays and so both my parents are gone now and it was pretty hard, but I suddenly felt this relief because I often had to be a caretaker. And the part of me that didn't have to be a caretaker anymore was a little bit freaking out because she didn't have a job, but she finally relaxed and all of a sudden. I can eat. I'm like after years, like GI doctor, again, this is my own story. I know. I have been to all the specialists that was on medicines. I did diets. Oh my gosh. And it was so much of it. I had no idea it was related to this underlying part of me that was always just slightly oh, something's going to happen. I'm going to have to take care of something. And I definitely changed that over the last couple of years, hugely changed that I did some constellation work that massively shifted my relationship with my mom. And so that was great. So before she passed, there was a huge shift, but there was still this little part that, yeah. I didn't realize. So now I'm savoring baking and making some cakes and sharing them with my neighbors and enjoying them and not having that, having an effect on me like it used to. And if I, if I still had that problem, I would probably just make different types of cakes, but I'm staying, I'm finding these little things to save her in the midst of going through my own loss again. And I'm going by creating just, I love going bike riding. It's something about bike riding is so nice. I love buying fresh flowers and arranging them in this fun, little way that I learned back at school, these little things to just take a moment and saver little things to find joy in. And there's no reason. It just, we never just feel one emotion. And I think sometimes people feel even I have felt guilty oh, there's so much suffering or this shit's happening. You being down and low and heavy all the time, doesn't help anybody. So yeah, have space for that. And it's a both. And, and see if you can do these other, other things to kind of like grow them around, the life that you're creating, have those sprinklings of things. Yeah. I mean, the

Pam:

example that I usually give for stuff like that, that you can have both. And is when you think about somebody or something of a being that you love more than anything, on the planet. And has there ever been a time where you've been that, that person, that entity has frustrated you and did it diminish your love? Yeah.

Aubri:

And I want to, I have said

Pam:

that my daughter, the entirety of your, her life. I love you so much. And right now I want to punch you across the room.

Aubri:

I'm going to lock

Pam:

you out on the balcony, how you can do both of these things at the exact same time to this day. I'll be like, she's a black belt in karate and we were doing karate together for a long time. And then, uh, last year, last summer, I went into a full heart block and I now have a pacemaker like out of nowhere. Oh, by the way, there's no medical reason for that. So that's a whole nother conversation. And so I can't do karate because I'm a hundred percent dependent on the pacemaker. So. It was a bummer, but that doesn't mean we don't still like spar in the kitchen. And so there are times that I'm like, I want to punch you right now, but like really punchy. Cause you're irritating me. But remember she's I know you love me more than anything else on the planet. I already know this mom. I'm like, got

Aubri:

it. Okay, great. And that's, I think that's important to have that sense of security. That's helped my relationship so much, we've my partner who I'm with now, I've been friends with forever and we, when we started dating, we put all our trauma on the table and all of our triggers. And I saw like a therapist and a spiritual director and some other mentor, and we're like, all right, we're not going to mess this one up. So it's that sort of yeah, we know we know how to engage, but a lot of it is based in the stuff we're talking about right now. Right. And it I love not trying to pitch him, but I love Stan Tatkin, his work. He does stuff on yeah. Healthy long-term relationships. He has been really good for me, but yeah. I I feel like I want to tell you what family constellation work is. Cause I keep mentioning it, but I don't know if you know about it. I don't know

Pam:

a ton about it. I've

Aubri:

Heard a little bit about it. Yeah. I would love. I have not the most amazing description. Like I think I keep trying to make it clear on my website because it's very hard to describe. So I do have a little click on this and read, read the long version, but I'll leave that up in the show notes,

Pam:

but basically

Aubri:

the process is the idea is that yeah, there's an interconnectedness in our family systems and our family system. Our ancestors has like the soul, it's all connected and we do pass things on and in the process, which is often. Most often done in a group situation you have the person wanting to receive healing, check in with you about what the issue is. You don't go into a lot of story but you will find ways of having the, uh, people related to this represented by other people. And, uh, the issue maybe itself can be represented as well. You can even have physical issues like I did with mine represented. And when you go into representation in this healing circle, you have this phenomenological experience where you will have sensations or images or thoughts that are not yours, but they seem to be very, very much like the person, the ancestor you're representing. This was a process that was. Put together by a German psychotherapist named Bert Hellinger who worked with the Zulu tribe and he integrated some of that work with some psycho, kind of family systems lens. And so, uh, yeah, it's interesting. It's an interesting process, but it's, it's so beautiful. And so what happens is you're allowed, you're able to then acknowledge these hidden things that are connected intergenerationally, or even in the most recent, generation. And when they're acknowledged, as we know the power of acknowledgement, heals things and the representatives will start to move or reposition themselves things start to reorder themselves. You can also use the field. We call it the field to bring in resources and bring in blessings and gifts that are needed for peace for things to happen. You can also use the process to like test check in a future outcomes. If you're trying to make decisions to resource yourself, to be able to face things to uncover things that are hidden and to resolve. So it's can use it for multiple different reasons, but you at the end, you end up with this beautiful kind of three-dimensional process and healed image. And I just, every time I facilitate, I'm always blown away for years now. I just am never shocked. So I'm not deciding what happens. I negotiated with what's there. And I sense where maybe there's some things that might be missing. And I did a session last week with someone who'd been really, really, really like depressed and low and stuck for a long time. And we looked at the, the male line in this pattern, in the mail line and had that represented. And then also there was when we checked in, there was actually some loss around miscarriage. Where his mom had had many, but never talked about it was hidden. And so once we acknowledged all of those beings that needed to be acknowledged, and also the ancestors, there was massive shift. And we brought in some healing. And then we did a little, little thing or could connect with his future self. And there was like this warm, thin, a lot of what we actually talked about today. Just cultivating more self love and compassion. And uh, yeah, I saw this person. Smiling so much more in the last week and I haven't forever. And I almost thought it was like, are you being cheeky? Are you, is this a joke? No, no, not at all. And it's amazing. And I had a woman once who had a really horrible loss. There was a really significant loss in her family. We won't go into details, but for years just heavy and, and angry and frustrated. And the work colleagues were just everything's being affected. And I've actually never seen someone shifts so quickly. And we were able to have this person who passed away acknowledged and. Unburdened, some of these, the guilts and acknowledge, it was needed for there to be peace. And at the end of that thing, she looked 10 years younger. Wow. It was just amazing. And then I, I got calls, uh, all my colleagues are saying I'm different. I have so much more energy. I'm living my life again. I'm going out, I'm having fun and celebrating life. This isn't what always happens like this that quickly, you know, but I just, I just blows, it always blows me away. How, how these things work. I ran into another lady at the other day actually, who did a session with me recently saying she looked like she looked like she was 10 years. I'm not kidding. 10 years younger, maybe even more. She just was glowing. Unburdening. Yeah. She just, she felt loved. And she felt like she mattered in the world and she let go of all these brands and she just, yeah, she just thanked me so much. And, and for that space and. So I, it just really touches my heart to do this work. I feel like it's, I found sort of the thing that I, I, I feel like I belong in that space and offering that space. And so that's what it's like, it's really hard to describe. I know there's going to be people going, how is that possible? How does that work? But things where you just need to experience it. And, and then, and then, yeah, and then there's some times where it's just the little subtle changes, little subtle changes. And one of my other clients who've said, we did all this stuff for me and my kids are like, My kids are telling me, dad has changed. You've changed. And uncle's T even though she's the one who had the session and so-and-so's changed. And, uh, what's, they're noticing the differences. There's just subtle differences in the whole family interacting differently. So it's not necessarily this really big, huge thing, but an interconnectedness that has shifted for everyone. And I just, yeah, I just think it's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Now, are you doing this work?

Pam:

You had said you can do it in relation, right? So two people. Is it

Aubri:

this, so you can, you can do it. I can do it. You can do it. One-on-one. So we have a different process. Traditionally it's done in a group. It could be done online. Yeah. So I do most of my sessions online. And we do a lot of groups online. They can be done in person as well. People can often just look for like family constellation practitioners, if they want to do it in person face-to-face to find someone near them. But I do. Yeah. So I run one-on-one sessions and then I also run groups. We can facilitate we can, if you want a private group, we can do a private group. But I also have regular events that I run that people can attend. Yeah. And every there's a lot of different people who do family and systemic constellation work. There's some people who do it just for businesses like a mate, they work huge businesses. I mean, I could see that this based on what you're saying,

Pam:

I could see how

Aubri:

this is having the things represented. You can have, uh, different aspects of the business represented and yeah, so, some people, uh, there's one of the teachers I studied with, he was like a natural doctor before he did this. And so he specializes in working with health and illness issues. There's some people who love working with specific issues. I I don't have a particular thing. I think for me, it's more about the space of self-compassion and always bringing that into whatever I do, so, that, that aspect is probably the thing that's most important for me. So people feel, okay. In the space and can receive whatever they need. Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes we have themes, but but I'm not, yeah. I don't have a particular thing that I'm just focused on in the work that I do other than.

Pam:

That's awesome. I'm like, okay, now I need to go look at our website and see where,

Aubri:

and so where can

Pam:

people find you? Where do you like to hang out online?

Aubri:

Yeah, so I do have a website. It's, it's a pretty, just basic website. Aubrey hathaway.com. My name so AUB, R I H a T H a w a y.com. And I'll probably start posting some events on there soon. I don't have my events tab up, but at the moment it's more of just, you can book in for one-on-ones or you can organize a group sort of session. This year I am going to be offering a. Train the trainer. So, I'm going to be actually offering online program to teach this work, or it's a weaving of the deep empathy practices with the constellation work together. And I'm, there's a little, I think, of a pop-up on my website right now, so you can sign up, we're going to do a little free web series to introduce what this work is and what I like about it is. That's interesting. I know a lot of people, I did my training with and other trainings I've done. They just do it because of the heat. Like they learn how to heal themselves and they can use it for their families. Not everyone does it to then be a official facilitator. Some people who are therapists do it to add an additional modality into their work, if they want to be a little bit more holistic or like working with a family systems lens. But yeah, so, so that's on there. Yeah, so that's where you can find me. I have an Instagram page. I'm not a, an instilled Liberty in any means, but I do post and I try to post, uh, some little. Thoughtful compassionate based reminders on there. And I also share my poetry on there, which is my little spark joy thing that I have in my life, but usually is related to some kind of shift I've been through. So I like to share that just to touch, if it touches people's hearts people are interested in this work. They can book in a discovery call and we can have a chat and to see if it feels right, if I'm the right person for them. I think that's important. I don't think everyone is right for everyone. So I think that's important. And then sometimes if I know. That someone else's more right. I might refer them to someone else, but yeah, so that's what that's there. It's pretty easy. You just go to the bookings tab and you click on discovery call. Yeah. But yeah, so this year I'm moving into more teaching. I've been getting asked by a lot of my clients and other people to, uh, just offer a bit more, uh, I used to teach yoga and do a lot of the other, like you were saying yoga embodiment thing. So that kind of informs what I do, but I'm not, teaching classes like that. So, so much. But when I do teach, if I run a workshop, we'll usually do some kind of guided embodiment practice to check in first.*************And that's a little bit involved before we go into doing the other stuff. Which I think is important. But yeah, mostly just sitting in that, that space. The family and systemic constellations and the deep compassion practices and just wanting to really help people to find that experience of, of self-acceptance and to unburden the things that are in the way of that. Yeah.

Pam:

Yeah. I love that, man. You're doing some amazing work, so

Aubri:

keep it up.

Pam:

Any other things that you want to add before we

Aubri:

wrap up? Sure. I feel like it's been hard and we've had to do really hard things this year. And I just, I think I want to acknowledge how much everyone has been going through and no matter who you are or where you are, just to acknowledge that and to offer, is there something you can do to be kind to yourself to nurture yourself? To love yourself today in spite of life's challenges. And if it feels okay, is there something little you can do to bring a bit of light into your life? The both end, can you be with that and maybe, maybe do something to connect to some warmth, some care, some nurturing, so enjoy smell the flowers, bake a cake share it with someone and and remember you're not alone cause we were all really going through a lot of things right now and yeah. Yeah. That's what I'll offer them.

Pam:

That's a great, it's a great little reminder and wrap up of what we've talked about. So thank you. Thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate you taking time out of your life, your schedule to hop on and chat with me.

Aubri:

Thank

Pam:

you. And guys, if there's anything specific or even broad that you want to share, or that has inspired you in today's podcast episode, please, please, please share it with us. Aubrey and I both linked in the show notes on Instagram. You can screenshot that you're listening to the episode and tag us in it. Uh, send us DMS. We would love to hear from you. And I just want to remind you all that. I appreciate the hell out of you. I'm so glad that you're here

Aubri:

listening, and I can't wait to

Pam:

share all that is coming next. Cause there's lots of things coming. So thank you guys. And I will see you all next week.